What you all think about the electronic logs (eobrs)

[Gus]

Dishonest? Yes, obviously. Have you ever told a small child about Santa Claus, the Easter bunny, etc? That's dishonest too if you want to get technical.

Nope, I haven't.

Unethical? How's it any less ethical then the cut-throats who haul cheap freight & lower the rates for everybody?

There's a difference between unethical and stupid. Hauling it for less than it takes to operate a truck profitably is just stupid. I sold my last truck in 2005 because I refused to keep operating for less and less.

I still believe a level playing field will force people to raise the rates.

 

[Ragged Rooster]

In my imperfect humble opinion, anyone who likes having elogs dictating their driving, is either lazy or can't or won't think for themselves. They are quite content with big brother riding electronically in the upper bunk. Reminds me of the union mentality.

Thankfully, I have never had to deal with them and I wouldn't work for anyone who has them. I have turned down driving jobs that paid 40cpm and more because of it. Qualcom was enough to steer me in the opposite direction. I've been running single sheet paper for 39 years and NEVER had a log issue. I'm quite capable of keeping my driving legal on my own. It seems to me that the more you dictate by computer, the more you limit a person's ability or want to think for himself. Hence, part of the reason for all the steering wheel holders out there on the roads. No need to think for yourself, it's done for you.

The thing I hear time and time again is drivers biotching about running out of hours 10 minutes from a rest area or truck stop and not allowed to move. The idiot shipper or receiver held them up for hours and now refuse to let them park there for their 10.
I prefer to have the option to make that 10 minute drive to somewhere with food and facilities. I believe (not positive) there's a chapter and verse in FMCSA on "safe havens".

Again, just my way of thinking.

 

[Duck]

I still believe a level playing field will force people to raise the rates.

The mega-fleets who already have e-logs, with their trucks turned down to granny speed want to "level the playing field".

They can afford to haul cheap freight because they buy their equipment & fuel in bulk so their per unit cost is far less than what an independent would pay, and they don't pay their drivers any more than they have to, and they keep their drivers out for weeks, even months at a time & run teams so they can keep their trucks moving & hauling that cheap freight. They also make money through dishonest truck leases.

They're politically active and push for EOBRs & speed limiters to be made mandatory for everyone. They're not looking for a "level playing field" & as long as their own trucks are not involved in accidents, they couldn't give a **** about "safety".

They want to run the independents and small fleets out of business so they can increase their market share. It's about eliminating the competition. The ATA continuously lobbies the feds to get them to put more burdens on the industry because while their members are big enough to survive, the small fleets & independents will have a harder time. Just last year I read about the ATA pushing for higher fuel taxes. It's easy to legislate your competition out of business when you're big enough to own a few high-ranking bureaucrats & congressmen.

Whose definition of a "level playing field" are you interested in? The ATA's version of the term "level the playing field" is more like the way Hiroshima was "leveled" at the end of WW2.

 

[DubbleD]

I made a post kind of poking at @blackw900 a few days ago, about "never admit to hauling freight for less than $3.50 a mile" or whatever number I used. But I was kinda serious.

If you haul a load for $2/mile, and tell everybody else you hauled it for $3/mi, then you'll convince people that load should pay $3. So when somebody is looking at a load that's offered at $2/mile, they'll say "well I know of somebody who got $3/mi for that run. And so they'll be more likely to give a high-ball figure and get that 2 dollar rate a little higher. They might not get it for $3/mile, but he might get $2.50. And then if he turns around and tells people he got the load for $3.50, the next guy might tell that broker he won't haul it for $2/mi because he knows somebody who hauled it for $3.50. If EVERYBODY lied about how much they're hauling freight for, it might eventually raise rates for the everyone. Everyone will think they're getting ripped off by the broker because "the last guy got it for $3.50 a mile", they'll demand higher rates.

Yeah, I know, .. just a pipe dream.

And Truck Drivers never lie...

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[DubbleD]

The talk about rates only applies to "truckers"...Not to "drivers", There is a distinct difference.

Trucker....

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Driver...

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[notarps4me]

The thing I hear time and time again is drivers biotching about running out of hours 10 minutes from a rest area or truck stop and not allowed to move. The idiot shipper or receiver held them up for hours and now refuse to let them park there for their 10.
I prefer to have the option to make that 10 minute drive to somewhere with food and facilities. I believe (not positive) there's a chapter and verse in FMCSA on "safe havens".

I asked a driver I know about that because they are now on elogs and that was one of my many questions I had pertaining to elogs. He said it is not an issue. You just don't want to wait 15 minutes before your time is up to try to find parking. When you get about a hour left pull in a truck stop. Document that there is no parking available and roll to another location. As long as you are attempting to stay in the HOS then you are OK. If you get to a shipper or receiver and you run out of time because they are dragging their feet and they run you off when you are done then you just notify your FM and you go find a place to park safely. Nothing is said or done to you.

On the topic of elogs taking away your thinking or planning. That is far from the truth. With loose leafing you just make the times work. With elogs you actually have to plan your trip well so you are where you need to be when you need to be there. There is no do overs with trip planning. Like I say I am old school. This is going to be a learning curve for me. I can go anywhere I want. I don't have to go back to maverick. I can go back to a triple digit long nose pete. 18 speed, no qualcomm. I pick all my loads. Run when I want to run and go where I want to go. Funny thing is I made more at maverick by being paid for all miles even bouncing, fuel bonuses, and having top notch equipment. A company that never jacked me around and treated me very well. I choose to go back to where I can get home on weekends and still make more than staying out a month at a time.

 

[Ragged Rooster]

The mega-fleets who already have e-logs, with their trucks turned down to granny speed want to "level the playing field".

They can afford to haul cheap freight because they buy their equipment & fuel in bulk so their per unit cost is far less than what an independent would pay, and they don't pay their drivers any more than they have to, and they keep their drivers out for weeks, even months at a time & run teams so they can keep their trucks moving & hauling that cheap freight. They also make money through dishonest truck leases.

They're politically active and push for EOBRs & speed limiters to be made mandatory for everyone. They're not looking for a "level playing field" & as long as their own trucks are not involved in accidents, they couldn't give a **** about "safety".

They want to run the independents and small fleets out of business so they can increase their market share. It's about eliminating the competition. The ATA continuously lobbies the feds to get them to put more burdens on the industry because while their members are big enough to survive, the small fleets & independents will have a harder time. Just last year I read about the ATA pushing for higher fuel taxes. It's easy to legislate your competition out of business when you're big enough to own a few high-ranking bureaucrats & congressmen.

Whose definition of a "level playing field" are you interested in? The ATA's version of the term "level the playing field" is more like the way Hiroshima was "leveled" at the end of WW2.

Exactly. They want the playing field leveled to THEIR level, NOT a level playing field which actually encourages fair market competition. The way I see it is if only one or two mega companies cut their trucks back to 55 and install EOBR's, they would be run out of business because they couldn't compete. It's like changing the rules when it comes to how hard you can hit a player in football. If they find a way to force everyone into compliance, aka their definition of level playing field, they have no competition except possibly how much lower they could drop their rate to cut the other guys throat. We've already found out where that gets us.
The only way to stop cheap freight is to leave the trucking industry alone. These mega carriers will soon find out that cheap freight is not the answer to staying in business.

 

[Ragged Rooster]

I asked a driver I know about that because they are now on elogs and that was one of my many questions I had pertaining to elogs. He said it is not an issue. You just don't want to wait 15 minutes before your time is up to try to find parking. When you get about a hour left pull in a truck stop. Document that there is no parking available and roll to another location. As long as you are attempting to stay in the HOS then you are OK. If you get to a shipper or receiver and you run out of time because they are dragging their feet and they run you off when you are done then you just notify your FM and you go find a place to park safely. Nothing is said or done to you.

On the topic of elogs taking away your thinking or planning. That is far from the truth. With loose leafing you just make the times work. With elogs you actually have to plan your trip well so you are where you need to be when you need to be there. There is no do overs with trip planning. Like I say I am old school. This is going to be a learning curve for me. I can go anywhere I want. I don't have to go back to maverick. I can go back to a triple digit long nose pete. 18 speed, no qualcomm. I pick all my loads. Run when I want to run and go where I want to go. Funny thing is I made more at maverick by being paid for all miles even bouncing, fuel bonuses, and having top notch equipment. A company that never jacked me around and treated me very well. I choose to go back to where I can get home on weekends and still make more than staying out a month at a time.

I respectfully beg to differ. I have spoken to many drivers who have been vilolated for moving after their EOBR shut them down. One guy was told to move off property at Loop Cold Storage in McAllen. I witnessed this personally. He even used my phone to call his company because his battery cratered.
5 hours after his live load appointment, he was still there. He could not even legally load because he was out of hours. He loaded anyway and then backed into an empty hole for his 10. Supposedly, the EOBR or qualcom doesn't catch the short distance he moved. Don't know that to be fact, but that's what he told me. Security saw where he parked and told him to vacate the premises because they needed that space for staging. He called dispatch and they told him to stay put. He finally called the police to try to solve the problem because he could not legally drive off the property. The police told him to move or be towed. He drove to the Flying J and was immediately violated by the clock. He had to fight with safety to get the infraction removed because too many violations get you booted. I suppose in a perfect world what you say is fine, but we all know trucking is far from perfect.

In the real world, you can't just call and tell your dispatcher that you are sorry but you only have an hour left on your 11 and this receiver says you won't be unloaded for another 3 hours so you're not delivering today, you're headed to the truck stop and deliver tomorrow when you have a fresh rack of hours. Try that with your company and see what they tell you.

Thank you but I refuse to go through all that crap for hours on end because some bureaucrat wants to dictate my every move.

 

[notarps4me]

I respectfully beg to differ. I have spoken to many drivers who have been vilolated for moving after their EOBR shut them down. One guy was told to move off property at Loop Cold Storage in McAllen. I witnessed this personally. He even used my phone to call his company because his battery cratered.

Do they drive for maverick?

 

[notarps4me]

In the real world, you can't just call and tell your dispatcher that you are sorry but you only have an hour left on your 11 and this receiver says you won't be unloaded for another 3 hours so you're not delivering today, you're headed to the truck stop and deliver tomorrow when you have a fresh rack of hours. Try that with your company and see what they tell you.

I drove for this company for 3 years. If you can't make your appointment they move the appt back. Safety comes first with them. They will tell you no load is worth your life. You keep talking about jacked up companies that don't care about their drivers.

 

[blackw900]

Driver......Only he needs to weigh in at about 500 pounds and smell like ass.

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Driver...For SWIFT that spends a lot of time under the dispatchers desk trying to make sure he gets his 1300 miles a week at 20 CPM.

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Fixed.....
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[Buckboard]

Had a guy come over to my truck in line to hit the scale and he asked to see my my log and I handed him my qualcomm and said, "It's in here. E-logs". He didn't take it and looked at me and I said..."You know how to use this?" He still just looked at me. I said..."Tell ya what... I can fax it to you there in your office from this thing and you can have me checked out by the time I'm done scaling. Ok?" He said to never mind and walked away. And yeah..."I ain't afraid to admitting being lazy". The company knows where my truck is, if the ignition is on, if it's moving and where it's moving to. Nothing more than punching a time clock at a real job. Not some "Big Brother in my shorts" thing to me. The thing got my dispatcher off my butt a couple of times. Told him my magic wand has run out of hours and needed a recharge.

That's my take on ELs. I'm a company by the mile wage earner. Do my day and keep the truck moving and park it when it's time. I'm not a complete lay down to authority either by any means. It's all just a game and I get paid for playing it.

 

[Tim]

I asked a driver...

Now ask a cop.

He said it is not an issue.

Nothin is an issue as long as you dont get busted.

You just don't want to wait 15 minutes before your time is up to try to find parking. When you get about a hour left pull in a truck stop. Document that there is no parking available and roll to another location. As long as you are attempting to stay in the HOS then you are OK.

So as long as you document it on E-logs it ok but on aper its not?
And tell a cop your attempting to stay within the 11/14 HOS when your 30 mins over. Thats only going to get you an escort to a parking spot with a OOS ticket unless your at the scales, then you can keep the cop company for the next 10 hours.

If you get to a shipper or receiver and you run out of time because they are dragging their feet and they run you off when you are done then you just notify your FM and you go find a place to park safely. Nothing is said or done to you.

Said company may not do nothing to you but a cop dont give a rats ass you were held up at a shipper or receiver.

Damn tarps, this aint your first time down the road and these e-logs aint a magic pass either. Once your 11/14/70 are up there up. These company's that use e-logs may tell you guys and gals to note it or we will give you 15 mins or what ever to find a parking spot, but if you have an accident watch how fast they wash there hands of you then. They will leave you swing worse than a screen door in a hurricane.

 

[Tim]

The thing got my dispatcher off my butt a couple of times. Told him my magic wand has run out of hours and needed a recharge.

So if you wear on a paper log you cant stand up for yourself or what? A log is a log, paper or electric.

 

[Tim]

Hell why dont we just go abck to using these................again
View attachment 16875

There was a time when most every truck had to have one and for what ever reason we got away from them and now e-log have become the in thing again.
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[saddlesore]

E-logs.. yup I have one and nope ain't a big fan of them..... neither are our customers... they ain't happy

 

[Buckboard]

So if you wear on a paper log you cant stand up for yourself or what? A log is a log, paper or electric.

Yeah...but the jerk-wad pushes a button and can see what I'm saying immediately and doesn't have to wait for the mail. Do you know how e-logs work? I'm very adapt at standing up for myself and e-logs are a no brainer. He sees it in thirty seconds.

 

[saddlesore]

Hell why dont we just go abck to using these................again
View attachment 16876

There was a time when most every truck had to have one and for what ever reason we got away from them and now e-log have become the in thing again.

Oh Hell... I think that I still have several sets of springs and a spare clock face in the garage!
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[Rigjockey]

Beleive it or not some companies are still using Tachographs.Those paper disks that you put in and it records everything.

 

[Tim]

Yeah...but the jerk-wad pushes a button and can see what I'm saying immediately and doesn't have to wait for the mail. Do you know how e-logs work? I'm very adapt at standing up for myself and e-logs are a no brainer. He sees it in thirty seconds.

So he thinks your lying to him when you tell him something? Nice.

Sorry I just dont buy it when a driver says they get there dispatchers off there butts when there out of hours. On the same token you can also tell a dispatcher your tired and need a nap and they can see you've been on duty for for 3 hours and on duty driving 6 with a 1 off duty brake and tell you to get your ass back to work also. Thats a 2 way street your driving on with that excuse.