Confirmed: E-logs suck
- Thread starter Duck
- Start date
Tazz
Infidel
He chose to sit there until his hours were up. He chose to park on the side of the road. He chose to drive a truck.Yeah, .... just like he CHOSE not to indulge in cannibalism that day.
People blame a lot of other people, and inanimate objects for their decisions. When in fact it was their choices that put them there.
Duck
Sarcastic remark goes here
Yeah. He chose to be detained at the shipper. He chose to have them kick him out. He chose to have no safe parking near the shipper.
Tell it to the hand.
Blood
Driveler Emeritus
Wow...
your hand has a really foul mouth, Duck!
I'm never talking to that prink again.
Anyway,
What's the difference legally whether you get detained or not?
What if you hire a guy to mow your lawn and he slams a six-pack in the process then insist on taking a nap in the yard?
Hey, you asked him to be there and he's risking a DWI if he leaves.
Why would you do that to anybody?
What a jerk you are, trying to force the poor guy to risk a DWI.
Listen to the hand, prink.
What's the difference legally whether you get detained or not?
What if you hire a guy to mow your lawn and he slams a six-pack in the process then insist on taking a nap in the yard?
Hey, you asked him to be there and he's risking a DWI if he leaves.
Why would you do that to anybody?
What a jerk you are, trying to force the poor guy to risk a DWI.
Listen to the hand, prink.
View attachment 8565
The difference is obvious....It is not your fault that the guy downed the beers.
It's like asking if the shipper/receiver has to allow me to stay on the yard because I sat in my truck and got drunk while they were loading me.
In that case they would bear no responsibility for the problem and could force you to leave.
In most cases they wouldn't let you drive the truck out though because if they knew you were drunk and forced you to drive, they would be a responsible party to any damages that were cause by you driving the truck off of their lot.
In the case of a shipper/receiver that wastes all of your available time, they caused the problem and are therefore responsible for the predicament that they put you in.
By forcing you to leave their lot, they are also a responsible party to anything that could potentially happen because they forced you to move your vehicle after they were informed that their actions resulted in you being outside of your legal driving hours.
In other words....legally stab them in the eye with their own bullshit!
Blood
Driveler Emeritus
So...
you want property rights to be dynamic depending on who has the best reasoning?
What if they don't waste your time?
What if circumstances cause you to arrive 30 minutes before the end of business?
Do you still want the customer to be liable?
Why not force them to open up any time you pull in?
It's not your fault if you get delayed by traffic or blow a tire when there is no safe haven between you and them.
I'm being ridiculous but you simply can't skew property rights to fit your individual notion of right n wrong.
If/when there is a case of wrongful death or some such tragedy won because of a business throwing someone out it may change some policies, or not.
Look at how the car companies determine whether to issue a recall.
If wrongful death suits are estimated to cost less money than letting a few people die...
too bad, so sad.
What about the A-hole states where the diesel cops shake you out to do an inspection in the middle of your break?
Unbelievable!!
If we were ever going to get something changed just because it's total B/S,
that should have been outlawed before I ever started driving.
It is a criminal act IMO, whether the law allows it or not.
Wake people up to insure that they are safe n legal...
Goofy bastards!!
Blood
Driveler Emeritus
I used to take a load almost weekly to Walmart in Los Lunas, NM.
Their policy at the time was that your appt is voided if you appear at the check in window after your appt time.
The problem was that you could spend 15 or 20 minutes in line sitting at the gate and 15 or 20 minutes standing in line at the window. So in reality you could have been there for 45 minutes and gotten screwed over for arriving late.
AND you couldn't arrive at the gate more than 1 hour prior to your appt time.
Total B/S but the load paid really well so I put up with it.
I did actually check in a little late there a couple of times but the gal in receiving always showed me as on time. The first time it happened I was about to blow a gasket standing in line just thinking about getting bumped because it takes a half hour to check in.
She would just mark you down on time and apologize for the delay saying that they were backed up which was the right thing to do but I'll bet there are plenty of DC's where they just blindly follow the policy and then act like you're a hot-head for getting bent out of shape.
Their policy at the time was that your appt is voided if you appear at the check in window after your appt time.
The problem was that you could spend 15 or 20 minutes in line sitting at the gate and 15 or 20 minutes standing in line at the window. So in reality you could have been there for 45 minutes and gotten screwed over for arriving late.
AND you couldn't arrive at the gate more than 1 hour prior to your appt time.
Total B/S but the load paid really well so I put up with it.
I did actually check in a little late there a couple of times but the gal in receiving always showed me as on time. The first time it happened I was about to blow a gasket standing in line just thinking about getting bumped because it takes a half hour to check in.
She would just mark you down on time and apologize for the delay saying that they were backed up which was the right thing to do but I'll bet there are plenty of DC's where they just blindly follow the policy and then act like you're a hot-head for getting bent out of shape.
Duck
Sarcastic remark goes here
Tim
U.S.Constitution
Just claim eminent domain as soon as you roll in.......problem solved!
Lawyers in fatality crashes with trucks often go after the trucker and his company. I believe it's time to encourage the lawyers to go after whatever business it was that held up the driver beyond his lawful hours and then forced him to leave, which required him to drive on public roads. It's actually a rare situation wherein a driver crashes between the customer and whatever safe parking is nearby, but I believe a few such lawsuits, especially if won, would get some attention.
kill all of the lawyers....
Buckboard
Well-Known Member
Same here with the window deal. I always nailed it and punching in "Arrived at receiver" as I set my breaks at the guard shack. Paperwork, dock assigned, at dock, disconnected, park bobtail head to receiving door/ window. Nine guys ahead of me and one employee working a window. By the time it's my turn to get things moving further along... the dude marks me as late. I strongly protest in my most professional/ not wanting to go to jail way and it's no use. The window prisk tells me that it's when I show up at his window and not the guard gate that determines timeliness. I wished him every plague and horror I could think of while I waited five hours. By now he should have curvature of the spine, a lazy eye, his pets are all mange riddled, his son refuses to wear men's clothes and his wife told him she was leaving him for another woman.
Tazz
Infidel
@Duck's hand he did not choose to have the dock take to long( he was not detained, they did not place shackles on him) he allowed it to happen. Which is a choice he made. Same as he chose to park in an unsafe location when his first decision went wrong.
His decisions lead him there. Not elogs, not the shipper, not the HOS, not his Boss, no one but him decides when to turn that key, no one but him is responsible in the end to remain in compliance.
Why do people want to bend over for shippers and receivers that would do that to them, then whine about allowing them to do it. Grow a set. When your times running short warn them your leaving, don't bluff just go. If your company pitches a fit ask them are they demanding you violate 395?
The answers gonna be no. Good then I am handling staying legal. Feel free to ask the customer when we can come back for the trailer. If they will not back you find one that will.
You'll be surprised how fast your paperwork is.released when you.calmly, politely inform them your leaving and it is not a negotiation. Tell them your just checking to see if they want a trailer support under the nose.
His decisions lead him there. Not elogs, not the shipper, not the HOS, not his Boss, no one but him decides when to turn that key, no one but him is responsible in the end to remain in compliance.
Why do people want to bend over for shippers and receivers that would do that to them, then whine about allowing them to do it. Grow a set. When your times running short warn them your leaving, don't bluff just go. If your company pitches a fit ask them are they demanding you violate 395?
The answers gonna be no. Good then I am handling staying legal. Feel free to ask the customer when we can come back for the trailer. If they will not back you find one that will.
You'll be surprised how fast your paperwork is.released when you.calmly, politely inform them your leaving and it is not a negotiation. Tell them your just checking to see if they want a trailer support under the nose.
Blood
Driveler Emeritus
The above real life situation is precisely what FMCSA needs to become aware of and find a working solution.
Drivers fear reprisal from employers if customers are unhappy.
There is a tremendous cost to businesses in acquiring clients and keeping them.
Think how you would feel as the person responsible for losing ...say....the Walmart account for Swift?
Sadly, if any one of Swifts drivers (hypothetically speaking) were to cause this loss... 20 companies are waiting in the wind to take over.... And they'll hire former Swifties as drivers cuz there will be some looking for a job.
Target, US Foods, Gordon Food Service, Tyson, and on and on... All utilize a union workforce and ..... Oh my gosh.... They all treat delivering drivers the same way... Poorly at best!
Lack of basic needs such as toilets and running water for drivers staged and awaiting their opportunity to unload is symptomatic of a larger problem caused by??
Unions?
Drivers fear reprisal from employers if customers are unhappy.
There is a tremendous cost to businesses in acquiring clients and keeping them.
Think how you would feel as the person responsible for losing ...say....the Walmart account for Swift?
Sadly, if any one of Swifts drivers (hypothetically speaking) were to cause this loss... 20 companies are waiting in the wind to take over.... And they'll hire former Swifties as drivers cuz there will be some looking for a job.
Target, US Foods, Gordon Food Service, Tyson, and on and on... All utilize a union workforce and ..... Oh my gosh.... They all treat delivering drivers the same way... Poorly at best!
Lack of basic needs such as toilets and running water for drivers staged and awaiting their opportunity to unload is symptomatic of a larger problem caused by??
Unions?
Duck
Sarcastic remark goes here
I read your post out loud to my hand, but the only thing it accomplished was making my dog look at me with his head cocked sideways & his ears up.
Let me go somewhere that refuses to let me use the restroom after a long wait, and I am likely not going to be allowed there again.
A working solution does need to be found for issues like what happened in this thread. Problem is, there is an adjustment period involved after decades of cooking the books to make things look good on paper. The problem has been there since long before elogs came along, but was masked due to the easy ability to rewrite history, rather than focusing on realistic rules being put into place.
It's gonna be screwed up for a while, but changes will be made to legally allow for movements to secure rest locations. Problem is, no matter how much rope you give the drivers, many will push it to the new limit and still find themselves in violation. It's kind of like having a maximum of 11 hours to drive. Instead of the 11 hours being looked at for what it is, a maximum, it is looked at as an exact number drivers feel they have to hit, leaving them in violation because they can't find a parking spot at the last minute. Or a 70mph speed limit, then complaining about a ticket for 75 because it was just 5 over. 70 was the maximum limit, don't cry because you got a hard nose cop that didn't give you the 5mph.
Staging areas are typically away from the actual facility and more than not.. outside the gated arena where the transfers take place so technically.. your not on company property so their liability is minimized to the amount of spaces they have available in the driveway.Let me go somewhere that refuses to let me use the restroom after a long wait, and I am likely not going to be allowed there again.
These... are important issues... along with the detention and ultimate invasion of a truck drivers livelihood that OOIDA ATA and all the rest should be attacking with a vigor.
I still can't believe they let the HOS rules through.
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