New EOBR Petition Thread

[Racer X 69]

If Americans weren't so arrogant they might be able to learn something from other cultures.

America established a unique and individual identity in the 1700's when our forefathers tossed a bunch of tea off a ship in Boston Harbor, and then engaged in a bloody battle to run the English back to the British Isles. So why should we undo 237 years of that which has made us who we are?

 

[stonefly]

The 2003 rules contained nothing about EOBRs. The split sleeper berth provision remained intact.

The lawsuit that got the rules thrown out mentioned neither EOBRs nor split time.


What happened?

 

[stonefly]

As intrusive as the EOBR is, regarding privacy and freedom from unnecessary interference and harassment, it's the HOS rules which require a driver to go back to bed for 8 hours after he's just been sleeping soundly for 7.

 

[Tazz]

But Europe is so enlightened:sarcasm:

 

[stonefly]

Here's what I can add from memory. Public Citizen and one or two other groups sued for the 2003 rules to be thrown out. I believe their gripe was that the rules allowed drivers too many hours driving in the course of a week.

The court threw out the rules, and I believe, as Blood posted, the rationale was "FMCSA's failure to study/cite the HOS effects on the health, safety & welfare of those subjected to the (new) HOS rules."

Here is what I remember. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong. I'm going back 8 or 9 years. The court said that the 2003 rules were OK as they were written. It was only an administrative error on the part of FMCSA which led the court to throw out the rules. Therefore, Public Citizen's suit was thrown out and the FMCSA's 2003 rules were restored to force of law.

In the meantime, however, being that the 2003 rules change had been tossed, the court ordered FMCSA to come up with something else by October, 2005. That is when the split sleeper berth provision was tossed.

One question I have is this. If the 2003 rules change was ultimately upheld by the court, citing only administrative shortcomings on the part of FMCSA, then why did not the court require that the 2003 rules revert in entirety to their original content? Why did not the court require that the split sleeper berth provision be restored to the rules?

Another question is this. If the split sleeper berth provision remained part of the 2003 rules change after the lengthy discussion and rule making, why was it thrown out hastily and without comment in October, 2005? If it was an important part of the rules for almost 70 years, and was considered important enough to be retained in the first major rules change in almost 70 years, why was it hastily thrown out of the rules as the result of a lawsuit in which it was not mentioned as part of the grievance?

 

[j911brick]

America established a unique and individual identity in the 1700's when our forefathers tossed a bunch of tea off a ship in Boston Harbor, and then engaged in a bloody battle to run the English back to the British Isles. So why should we undo 237 years of that which has made us who we are?

Sounds good, but our unique identity is based on experiences our forefathers and immigrants brought with them from civilizations all over the world. Where would we be if we were to totally discount everything that isn't uniquely American. Much of our own civilization would not even exist if we had not adopted from other countries things like gunpowder, the gun, watercraft, the automobile, the airplane, our legal system, the telephone, religion, and countless others things which were all invented by somebody else.

Also: aren't you one of those guys that is always bitching about people driving slow in the left lane (and you think slower traffic should keep right?). Well, that's basically european law. So in reality you agree with the way they do it elsewhere and you support adopting their ways.

Furthermore: as I stated previously; just because we do it one way, here, today, does not mean we are right, or there isn't room for improvement and change; and there is nothing wrong with looking to other resources to see how they do it.

 

[Duck]

Sounds good, but our unique identity is based on experiences our forefathers and immigrants brought with them from civilizations all over the world. Where would we be if we were to totally discount everything that isn't uniquely American. Much of our own civilization would not even exist if we had not adopted from other countries things like gunpowder, the gun, watercraft, the automobile, the airplane, our legal system, the telephone, religion, and countless others things which were all invented by somebody else.

Also: aren't you one of those guys that is always bitching about people driving slow in the left lane (and you think slower traffic should keep right?). Well, that's basically european law. So in reality you agree with the way they do it elsewhere and you support adopting their ways.

Furthermore: as I stated previously; just because we do it one way, here, today, does not mean we are right, or there isn't room for improvement and change; and there is nothing wrong with looking to other resources to see how they do it.

Airplanes were invented in Ohio, and first flown in North Carolina.

Telephones were invented in Boston, Massachusetts.

 

[j911brick]

We have are own. Dont try and change ares to look like someone else for if you do then we loose ares. If .

Change is what built this country in the first place. Change is why our forefathers left the motherland in the first place. If we didn't change we would all still be living in log cabins and driving wagon trains. Is that what you want?

 

[j911brick]

Airplanes were invented in Ohio, and first flown in North Carolina.

Telephones were invented in Boston, Massachusetts.

You might want to do your home work. airplanes (flying machines) were around long before the Wright brothers. They are only credited with the first POWERED flight, and even that is disputed. The telephone is also disputed as to have been invented in Germany, before Bell, but transcontinental communications was slow and the US didn't get the word till after Bell made his call.

 

[Duck]

You might want to do your home work. airplanes (flying machines) were around long before the Wright brothers. They are only credited with the first POWERED flight, and even that is disputed.

Leonardo DaVinci made some drawings of an ornithopter, and some other guys made (and crashed) some gliders.

The telephone is also disputed as to have been invented in Germany, before Bell, but transcontinental communications was slow and the US didn't get the word till after Bell made his call.

Bull****.

 

[Racer X 69]

Sounds good, but our unique identity is based on experiences our forefathers and immigrants brought with them from civilizations all over the world. Where would we be if we were to totally discount everything that isn't uniquely American. Much of our own civilization would not even exist if we had not adopted from other countries things like gunpowder, the gun, watercraft, the automobile, the airplane, our legal system, the telephone, religion, and countless others things which were all invented by somebody else.

Also: aren't you one of those guys that is always bitching about people driving slow in the left lane (and you think slower traffic should keep right?). Well, that's basically european law. So in reality you agree with the way they do it elsewhere and you support adopting their ways.

Furthermore: as I stated previously; just because we do it one way, here, today, does not mean we are right, or there isn't room for improvement and change; and there is nothing wrong with looking to other resources to see how they do it.

You wanna go back to bouncing along above the steer axle in the ergonomic nightmare known as a cabover tractor go ahead. Meanwhile, I will arrogantly ride in the comfort of a conventional rig. I've driven a number of different cabover trucks over the past 40 years, and cussed every one.

And yes I have been known to complain about left lane bandits. The rules of the road are keep right except to pass. Some states even have laws prohibiting left lane usage except for passing. I can't imagine the arrogant Texas lawmakers ever admitting that anyone came up with "Left Lane Is For Passing Only" but them.

 

[j911brick]

Leonardo DaVinci made some drawings of an ornithopter, and some other guys made (and crashed) some gliders.



Bull****.

History of aviation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[j911brick]

Leonardo DaVinci made some drawings of an ornithopter, and some other guys made (and crashed) some gliders.



Bull****.

Credit for the invention of the electric telephone is frequently disputed, and new controversies over the issue have arisen from time-to-time. Charles Bourseul, Antonio Meucci, Johann Philipp Reis, Alexander Graham Bell, and Elisha Gray, amongst others, have all been credited with the telephone's invention

History of the telephone - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Duck]

History of aviation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

From that article:

According to the Smithsonian Institution and Fédération Aéronautique Internationale (FAI), the Wrights made the first sustained, controlled, powered heavier-than-air manned flight at Kill Devil Hills, North Carolina, four miles (8 km) south of Kitty Hawk, North Carolina on December 17, 1903.

Credit for the invention of the electric telephone is frequently disputed, and new controversies over the issue have arisen from time-to-time. Charles Bourseul, Antonio Meucci, Johann Philipp Reis, Alexander Graham Bell, and Elisha Gray, amongst others, have all been credited with the telephone's invention

History of the telephone - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Doesn't prove/disprove anything.

 

[j911brick]

From that article:

According to the Smithsonian Institution and Fédération Aéronautique Internationale (FAI), the Wrights made the first sustained, controlled, powered heavier-than-air manned flight at Kill Devil Hills, North Carolina, four miles (8 km) south of Kitty Hawk, North Carolina on December 17, 1903.



Doesn't prove/disprove anything.

Right, but it wasn't the first flight of an aircraft.

 

[Duck]

Right, but it wasn't the first flight of an aircraft.

Clumsy bird-shaped gliders and hydrogen balloons aren't a very popular mode of air travel these days. The Wright Bros made the first one that takes off on it's own and can fly with a person on it, and not crash. Therefore they're credited with building the first viable aircraft.

Built in Ohio, where the license plates currently say "birthplace of aviation", it was hauled to North Carolina for it's first flight, where the license plates say "first in flight".

 

[j911brick]

Clumsy bird-shaped gliders and hydrogen balloons aren't a very popular mode of air travel these days. The Wright Bros made the first one that takes off on it's own and can fly with a person on it, and not crash. Therefore they're credited with building the first viable aircraft.

Built in Ohio, where the license plates currently say "birthplace of aviation", it was hauled to North Carolina for it's first flight, where the license plates say "first in flight".

In 1874, Félix du Temple built the "Monoplane", a large plane made of aluminium in Brest, France, with a wingspan of 13 meters and a weight of only 80 kilograms (without the driver). Several trials were made with the plane, and it is generally recognized that it achieved lift off under its own power after a ski-jump run, glided for a short time and returned safely to the ground, making it the first successful powered flight in history, although the flight was only a short distance and a short time.

 

[Duck]

In 1874, Félix du Temple built the "Monoplane", a large plane made of aluminium in Brest, France, with a wingspan of 13 meters and a weight of only 80 kilograms (without the driver). Several trials were made with the plane, and it is generally recognized that it achieved lift off under its own power after a ski-jump run, glided for a short time and returned safely to the ground, making it the first successful powered flight in history, although the flight was only a short distance and a short time.

The Wright Bros didn't need no stinkin' downhill ski-jump.

They also didn't have anybody talking about forcing them to equip their plane with an EOBR.

 

[Injun]

 

[j911brick]

The Wright Bros didn't need no stinkin' downhill ski-jump.

They also didn't have anybody talking about forcing them to equip their plane with an EOBR.

Actually they need a catapult and a rail.

WRIGHT BROTHERS FIRST FLIGHT - YouTube