Owner Operator Transporting Alcohol As A Motor Carrier

[Mike]

Let's discuss the confusing and costly thing called alcohol permits.

I am currently researching the cost and value of adding alcohol permits. I live in Arkansas, so Texas is a big one for me and one that could have come in handy a few times when I have been out in Califonia. The overall cost for that one is $312 for two years.

Others for me to consider (and I haven't yet researched the cost) are New Mexico and Oklahoma.

My home state of Arkansas shows to require one, but Arkansas State Police assures me that I don't need one, and nobody I have talked to yet regarding this has even known what permits I would need as a motor carrier. So, I operate without one, and with a number to the officer who did my new entrant audit. He told me to call him if an issue on this ever arose.

Haven't paid close attention to rates for alcohol, other than California where the rates have always looked pretty good going back to Arkansas or Texas, but the lack of permitting has prevented me from doing the loads.

So, with that said, as a small carrier (one truck, or a relatively small amount of trucks) do you see value in pursuing the permitting needed to transport alcohol, or do you see it as not being worth it?

Depending on how far I would want to expand this, I may even look into states such as Indiana and Ohio, but for now, mostly focusing on Western/Southwestern states to cover trips into and out of Texas, and potential loads from the west coast back towards home.

 

[Electric Chicken]

This is a good question. I'm going to
follow this.

 

[Sinister]

I've hauled tons of booze out of KY years back. There were always loads going back up into the twin cities and the companies I drove for never hesitated to book these loads.

Four Roses, Jim Beam, some place in Louisville I can't remember. Coming out of the Four Roses distillery there was a house with a lawn sign. It said "ALCOHOL IS THE DEVILS PLAYGROUND". I would always think, "All the stuff going on in the world today and your hootin hollering church zeroes in on that."

I don't know about California but it always seemed like a decent way to get out of Kentucky. My company may just have been using them to move the truck too so I cannot comment on rates.

Also, this very timely information is from about 1999 or so.

 

[Slowpoke KW]

I’ve never hauled any myself but a friend done good hauling a lot of it out of Ft Worth and Shiner in the late 90’s early 2000’s

 

[Uncle Birchy]

For $312 @Mike I'd say just get it and see how much ya use it then evaluate at renewal time.

If ya end up doing booze alot you'll wonder why you hadn't before

Turns out ya don't use it enough then just don't renew it next year.

 

[Mike]

So far, Texas is the only costly one.
Oklahoma is $23/year. New Mexico is something like $50/3 years.

So, total cost per year to cover all three states is under $200/year.

I may go forward with this. I’ve already bypassed more money than this by not being able to legally carry alcohol loads that would take me into these states, and having it in Texas and Oklahoma makes it much easier to grab freight out of Texas coming back home.

 

[Electric Chicken]

DDI had a booze license. I didn't run any because #teamnohills.

Not sure if it was nicely profitable or simply scrounging for anything they could get.

 

[Sinister]

So far, Texas is the only costly one.
Oklahoma is $23/year. New Mexico is something like $50/3 years.

So, total cost per year to cover all three states is under $200/year.

I may go forward with this. I’ve already bypassed more money than this by not being able to legally carry alcohol loads that would take me into these states, and having it in Texas and Oklahoma makes it much easier to grab freight out of Texas coming back home.

The flip side, is that I also vividly remember waiting vast amounts of time at places like Samuel Adam's and Anheuser Busch.

But again that's a long time ago.

 

[mndriver]

Interesting to see what’s required for Ohio.

 

[Mike]

Interesting to see what’s required for Ohio.

The way I am reading it, appears to be a $300 permit. Whether it is a yearly permit, a one time permit, or something else, I don't see info on that yet.

It also comes with the potential requirement to produce a monthly report of alcohol movements, along with showing proof if required.

Section 4303.22 - Ohio Revised Code | Ohio Laws

codes.ohio.gov

 

[Mike]

Indiana is a notarized application and a $5.00 fee. So, every year, you gotta plan on visiting a notary. Oklahoma requires a notary as well, I believe.

Alcohol Permit Applications & Forms

www.in.gov

 

[Uncle Birchy]

The way I am reading it, appears to be a $300 permit. Whether it is a yearly permit, a one time permit, or something else, I don't see info on that yet.

It also comes with the potential requirement to produce a monthly report of alcohol movements, along with showing proof if required.

Section 4303.22 - Ohio Revised Code | Ohio Laws

codes.ohio.gov

Indiana is a notarized application and a $5.00 fee. So, every year, you gotta plan on visiting a notary. Oklahoma requires a notary as well, I believe.

Alcohol Permit Applications & Forms

www.in.gov

Damn all that just to haul some Buttwiper beer.

 

[Sinister]

Indiana is a notarized application and a $5.00 fee. So, every year, you gotta plan on visiting a notary. Oklahoma requires a notary as well, I believe.

Alcohol Permit Applications & Forms

www.in.gov

Are these for picking up and delivering in these states?

Or also for transporting through them?

Seems like it's becoming a tangled web...

 

[Mike]

Are these for picking up and delivering in these states?

Or also for transporting through them?

Seems like it's becoming a tangled web...

Different for each state. There are a few companies that have made information available for this, but I’ve found that none of them are completely accurate.

Convoy has a pretty good one that other websites seem to copy and portray as their own information.

Alcohol Permit Requirements by State

If you are hauling a Convoy load that requires the carrier to have a state issued alcohol movement permit, you may refer to the table below for the contact information of the relevant issuing agenc...

support.convoy.com

Personally, I think this is a very backwards mentality issue. It’s 2021, we should be beyond the need for this completely confusing web of permit requirements to haul something that is legal in all states.

 

[gearjammer]

Personally, I think this is a very backwards mentality issue. It’s 2021, we should be beyond the need for this completely confusing web of permit requirements to haul something that is legal in all states.

just think of as a revenue enhancer along the lines of a a speedtrap

 

[mndriver]

I post this because of his comments on how many laws there are (and this was several years ago) that at any given time we are breaking one whether we’re trying or not.




So no matter what you do, some where, some how, no matter how hard you try not to, you’re breaking a law

 

[Uncle Birchy]

Different for each state. There are a few companies that have made information available for this, but I’ve found that none of them are completely accurate.

Convoy has a pretty good one that other websites seem to copy and portray as their own information.

Alcohol Permit Requirements by State

If you are hauling a Convoy load that requires the carrier to have a state issued alcohol movement permit, you may refer to the table below for the contact information of the relevant issuing agenc...

support.convoy.com

Personally, I think this is a very backwards mentality issue. It’s 2021, we should be beyond the need for this completely confusing web of permit requirements to haul something that is legal in all states.

It's called 50 states.

Frankly trucking should be covered under the Commerce Clause meaning only Federal Standards apply to trucking forcing the States to scrap their laws and nullify them.

 

[Hammer166]

It's been a long time since I've pulled a box, but beer isn't worth the hassle. Liquor and wine I didn't mind, but breweries, specifically Anheuser Busch, aren't worth the trouble.

They'll weigh you in and out, but you don't get a weight until you're outside the gate. Meaning a bunch of time wasted on phone calls if you need reworked. I'm fully aware that dipshit drivers insisting on loading it their way instead of listening to loaders, then insisting on a rework, is what caused this. But screw AB for making my life a nightmare because their load is 2k heavier than what they claim.

 

[Mike]

It's been a long time since I've pulled a box, but beer isn't worth the hassle. Liquor and wine I didn't mind, but breweries, specifically Anheuser Busch, aren't worth the trouble.

They'll weigh you in and out, but you don't get a weight until you're outside the gate. Meaning a bunch of time wasted on phone calls if you need reworked. I'm fully aware that dipshit drivers insisting on loading it their way instead of listening to loaders, then insisting on a rework, is what caused this. But screw AB for making my life a nightmare because their load is 2k heavier than what they claim.

Approaching alcohol permits comes from a carrier perspective. Those things you mention I will always factor in. All of this must be considered with negotiating a rate and negotiating detention and layover pay.

It is also all part of the deciding factor as to whether to get the permits or not. Going to the massive sized breweries is rarely going to be a more profitable venture unless a broker is desperate to move a load. Most of those placesAre dead set on the rates and they know they will be able to move the product, or the receiver on the other end knows the product won’t arrive until it can be moved at the set rate.

 

[mndriver]

The last time I hauled beer out of AB out of Columbus resulted in a visit from the local police. The shipper insisted I leave and get a cat scale ticket. I refused off of my air gauges. Even their on-site scale showed I was over axle and illegal bridge weight. I think the bridge part really caught them off guard.

Finally the two initial officers brought in their truck compliance officer that was on-duty who set a few people straight as well on bridge laws and why that “dumb truck driver” was correct.

St. Louis AB is about the only one I really enjoyed working with. They knew the difference between loading a reefer and a dry van.