If you HAD TO buy an emissions, pre-2013 truck, what would it be?

cbradiohead

Active Member
Hello, we're based in CA and because of CARB, we need to upgrade to 2008 (2007 engine) and newer. So a glider is out and anything below 2007 (2006 engines) needs an aftermarket DPF which I keep reading is a horrible idea. We need to upgrade a total of 5-6 units, about 3-4 day cabs and 1-2 sleepers

Yes, the emission research says many issues with 2007-2012 trucks, specifically 2007 and 2011 model years but financially, we won't be able to avoid getting at least a couple of pre-2013 trucks. This is after a review of cash flow, income statements and balance sheet. We won't be able to get a large loan or line of credit from a bank that would allow us to get all 2013 and newer trucks. And because of the lack of significant equity at this time, the lease companies are unlikely to offer us a full 5-6 set of 2013 or newer units We are working our way out of some really tough times back in 2011/early 2012. So if you had to get one which would it be?

If I get enough feedback saying to just flat out keep avoiding the pre 2013s (I've read mixed advice on the 2012's) then we'll upgrade slowly and hope that CARB doesn't star dishing out heavy fines. I don't see them doing that but it is late 2014. Btw, I wasn't with the company before or all of this research would have been complete a while ago Thank you for your time and help. This forum has been very helpful, I'm definitely thankful guys.
 
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Hard to say, really. My concern with getting any late model used truck is whether you might be purchasing somebody else's nightmare or not. Definitely do a rigdig on any truck you are looking to purchase, to see if there has been a ton of work done on the truck.

Avoid fleet trucks, as they are known to do as little maintenance as possible on their trucks because they are only concerned with them lasting until they can trade them in. As profits tighten, maintenance is often the first thing to get cut back on.

If you can upgrade new a little at a time, that would be the way to go, IMO.

If you go Freightliner, make sure you get a DD13 or DD15, avoid the series60 emissions engines. I would try to at least get a 2012 if you go this route.

Cummins, go as new as you possibly can, lots of issues there that had to be worked out over time.

From all I have heard, PACCAR was a bit of a nightmare as well up until 2013.

Wouldn't touch a CAT.

I'm convinced Detroit is your safest bet, although I did take a risk this year with a PACCAR powered 2015 KW. Time will tell if I made a mistake or not, but I would have loved to have gotten the truck I got with a DD15 powering it.

Again, RigDig whatever you look at buying so you can minimize your risk as much as possible.
 
Hard to say, really. My concern with getting any late model used truck is whether you might be purchasing somebody else's nightmare or not. Definitely do a rigdig on any truck you are looking to purchase, to see if there has been a ton of work done on the truck.

Avoid fleet trucks, as they are known to do as little maintenance as possible on their trucks because they are only concerned with them lasting until they can trade them in. As profits tighten, maintenance is often the first thing to get cut back on.

If you can upgrade new a little at a time, that would be the way to go, IMO.

If you go Freightliner, make sure you get a DD13 or DD15, avoid the series60 emissions engines. I would try to at least get a 2012 if you go this route.

Cummins, go as new as you possibly can, lots of issues there that had to be worked out over time.

From all I have heard, PACCAR was a bit of a nightmare as well up until 2013.

Wouldn't touch a CAT.

I'm convinced Detroit is your safest bet, although I did take a risk this year with a PACCAR powered 2015 KW. Time will tell if I made a mistake or not, but I would have loved to have gotten the truck I got with a DD15 powering it.

Again, RigDig whatever you look at buying so you can minimize your risk as much as possible.

Thank you for the advice. I'm going to sign up for a Rig Dig account. What you're saying goes hand in hand with what I'm leaning towards and what other research has been saying. I don't have much info on the DD13s in regards to new emission tech working with them but I'll keep looking. I just hate that we might have to spend a lot of $$ on newer day cab trucks for the local operations when that work only requires decent, older trucks like 2002s-2005s or so. The maintenance isn't bad since its short distances and not too heavy. We have a 1998 International day cab that's been running pretty problem free, its crazy. Aint giving that truck up until CARB pries it out my hands! :]

And yeah, your truck was the first thing I read about on this forum. You said $9k more for a lot more truck and the MPG seems good last time I checked. You had a 2012 freightliner before that I believe. DPF + DEF? How was that running for you?
 
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Thank you for the advice. I'm going to sign up for a Rig Dig account. What you're saying goes hand in hand with what I'm leaning towards and what other research has been saying. I don't have much info on the DD13s in regards to new emission tech working with them but I'll keep looking. I just hate that we might have to spend a lot of $$ on newer day cab trucks for the local operations when that work only requires decent, older trucks like 2002s-2005s or so. The maintenance isn't bad since its short distances and not too heavy. We have a 1998 International day cab that's been running pretty problem free, its crazy. Aint giving that truck up until CARB pries it out my hands! :]

And yeah, your truck was the first thing I read about on this forum. You said $9k more for a lot more truck and the MPG seems good last time I checked. You had a 2012 freightliner before that I believe. DPF + DEF? How was that running for you?
I thought all trucks had to have at least a DPF on em day cabs included:confused-96:. the only thing that I knew that was exempt was emergency vehicles because of the problems with the DPF and them starting up or stalling:D
 
I thought all trucks had to have at least a DPF on em day cabs included:confused-96:. the only thing that I knew that was exempt was emergency vehicles because of the problems with the DPF and them starting up or stalling:D


Yeah I meant to ask if he had DPF and DEF as well but now that I recall some online research and think all regularly manufactured 2010 and newer trucks have both DPF + DEF. Not sure though.
 
Yeah I meant to ask if he had DPF and DEF as well but now that I recall some online research and think all regularly manufactured 2010 and newer trucks have both DPF + DEF. Not sure though.
I ment the truck had to have atleast a DPF for the carb commies. I was wondering how you were getting away with running a 1998 international in commieforina:confused-96:. I belive 2007 some manufactures stared putting the DPF's on and 2008 they all came with DPF's. same with the def tank not all manufactures started putting them on in 2010 but I belive that they all had def tanks in 2011 though. I would be safe and say anything after 2011 has DPF and DEF on them and that would be good for the carb commies until they think of another stupid idea:confused:. a truck with no def tank and just a dpf is only good till 2023 out here:(
 
I ment the truck had to have atleast a DPF for the carb commies. I was wondering how you were getting away with running a 1998 international in commieforina:confused-96:. I belive 2007 some manufactures stared putting the DPF's on and 2008 they all came with DPF's. same with the def tank not all manufactures started putting them on in 2010 but I belive that they all had def tanks in 2011 though. I would be safe and say anything after 2011 has DPF and DEF on them and that would be good for the carb commies until they think of another stupid idea:confused:. a truck with no def tank and just a dpf is only good till 2023 out here:(

Actually, CARB states that you need a PM filter (DPF) and doesn't say about a DEF but I'll have to confirm with them. They seem concerned with soot and not Nox but of course that can change. So yeah, it would make sense if all 2010+ engines had DPFs.

And frankly we've been running some old trucks because of their lack of enforcement. I made that call when the company owner was stressing out at their last deadline and wanted to rush an upgrade for everything. I just didnt see them being able to 1/Enforce fully and quickly 2/Actually collect the fines

But its a gov agency, though they are slow they will eventually get the power they need for their madness. One of my colleagues was doing some research and supposedly at some point they won't allow you to renew either your DMV registration or some other baloney. I'm not upgrading everything until they really have that much power.
 
carb is not about expanding business in commieforina . fist of all it's all about control!! and there regulations on the trucking industry seem to be outrages. I was thinking about expanding my business but after doing the moronic idiot gymnastics in my head!! I keep hearing that more states are gonna be following the moronic idiots laws on air quality. i'm looking forward to seeing this and have been trying to gather more info on it but I can't find anything I know mike was wondering to as well. I read some where that if your truck wasn't compliant the they wouldn't renew you as well. carb is nothing but a bunch of **** tards sucking off the tax payers dollar. avoid tulre as they hired some ****ing looser to drive around in a van to see if people are idling. that's worse than that idiot that they hired to spy on truckers on the road i'm glad that POS went away!
 
Guess I better buy my BINGO plate, then, huh?
a bingo plate are you kidding me :confused-96:. for these moronic idiots that run this state I was thinking more like a wack a mole game and put them in it for entertainment purposes before we toss em in the gas chamber. since there so freaking useless and greedy:stirpot2:
 
If all of the states are going to this, we will have no further need for IFTA and will revert back to the BINGO plates.
 
Wrong thread. I thought the gripin' about CARB was in the mileage tax thread.

But, to answer your question, trucks had to have a base registration (the license plate) plus registrations for all of the states they ran in. The BINGO plate held all of the registration tags that were not from the base state.

The BINGO plate looked like this:

4070275402_936481c012.jpg
 
Wrong thread. I thought the gripin' about CARB was in the mileage tax thread.

But, to answer your question, trucks had to have a base registration (the license plate) plus registrations for all of the states they ran in. The BINGO plate held all of the registration tags that were not from the base state.

The BINGO plate looked like this:

4070275402_936481c012.jpg
ok i see now. though that looks so 70's:D
 
Wrong thread. I thought the gripin' about CARB was in the mileage tax thread.

But, to answer your question, trucks had to have a base registration (the license plate) plus registrations for all of the states they ran in. The BINGO plate held all of the registration tags that were not from the base state.

The BINGO plate looked like this:

4070275402_936481c012.jpg


Goodness, thats some classic non-technological way to do business. Hopefully this stopped sometime in the 90s at the latest.

Well found out recently any financial assistance CARB provided is non existent now. They must have run out of just closed it off. You can only hope your regular equipment upgrade cycle kicks in before other states start to do this. Eventually all states with more than a couple of ghost towns will want cleaner air. who knows when.
 

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