Motor Carrier States that will tax you for picking up or delivering in their state. What situations have you seen?

[Mike]

First off, don't say that that you would just leave, or anything silly like that, because that's not going to happen. If you are in this situation, you are going to have to address it properly and know where you stand legally.

So, I will start it with a situation from New Jersey. Not my situation, but one that I just read about happening.

So, I have a question because I am in uncharted waters. I had a driver that got stopped at the scales in New Jersey today. They called me and said that I have not paid my taxes in the state for 3 years. Well, I have never owed taxes in NJ because we are based out of South Carolina. They said that it was a franchise tax that I owed for buying and selling goods and services in that state and the assessment was $8800.00 due immediately or the truck and trailer would be impounded. I told them that I do not buy or sell goods in the state, nor do I buy or sale goods at all, my customers do, I just transport them. They said "well we do not know if you do or not, but you must pay this assessment now, or we will impound it" I called around and I was told that they could, and I have to pay now, then appeal, and I would get my money back in 300-400 days after I appeal. Has anyone ever heard of this? This is insanity. With all this being said, careful if you are going thru NJ, because they are doing a blitz at scale houses for this very thing. Any insight from anyone with any experience with this would be very helpful. In case anyone wants to respond with any criticism, I will save you time by saying that I pay all taxes and fees that I am supposed to pay, this "fine or assessment" was based on me paying taxes on a franchise that buys and sells goods in nj, which I absolutely do not do.

Truck owner has a driver trapped at a scale. Pay or have truck impounded. Impounded equals massive daily fees that will reach the ransom fee very quickly, so don't think you are just gonna allow the truck to be impounded and get the driver transportation home.

Where is this happening, and what do you do to protect yourself?

 

[Hammer166]

First off, don't say that that you would just leave, or anything silly like that, because that's not going to happen. If you are in this situation, you are going to have to address it properly and know where you stand legally.

So, I will start it with a situation from New Jersey. Not my situation, but one that I just read about happening.



Truck owner has a driver trapped at a scale. Pay or have truck impounded. Impounded equals massive daily fees that will reach the ransom fee very quickly, so don't think you are just gonna allow the truck to be impounded and get the driver transportation home.

Where is this happening, and what do you do to protect yourself?

Ya stay the heck away from those money grubbing bastards!

Seriously though, this is a place where the federal government is supposed to step in and tell the state to knock it off! This is no different than if a state said to Microsoft (assuming MS has no offices there) "We know you're making income from people using your product in our craphole state. You owe us income taxes!"

 

[mndriver]

Kind of like arkansas' ad valorem tax

 

[Mike]

Ya stay the heck away from those money grubbing bastards!

Seriously though, this is a place where the federal government is supposed to step in and tell the state to knock it off! This is no different than if a state said to Microsoft (assuming MS has no offices there) "We know you're making income from people using your product in our craphole state. You owe us income taxes!"

What sucks in this situation, though, is that your equipment, and employee, is basically held hostage. Your only fight is court, but they will take your truck until that point.

 

[Mike]

Kind of like arkansas' ad valorem tax

Maybe. But have you seen anybody have their equipment taken like what was posted here by this tax?

I don't know how others deal with the ad valorem tax, but I am notified of it far ahead of time of when it will be due, rather than being surprised about it in this fashion.

 

[Hammer166]

Maybe. But have you seen anybody have their equipment taken like what was posted here by this tax?

I don't know how others deal with the ad valorem tax, but I am notified of it far ahead of time of when it will be due, rather than being surprised about it in this fashion.

These are the same states that will arrest folks for transporting their firearms in a manner that has been deemed legal by SCOTUS and require them to use an affirmative defense when court date rolls around. They also believe you have to prove you no longer live in their state if you move away, often for years after the move.

Like I said, the feds need to step in and reign them in.

 

[Mike]

These are the same states that will arrest folks for transporting their firearms in a manner that has been deemed legal by SCOTUS and require them to use an affirmative defense when court date rolls around. They also believe you have to prove you no longer live in their state if you move away, often for years after the move.

Like I said, the feds need to step in and reign them in.

Yes, aware of that. To keep it on trucking though, how do you deal with this? Losing guns is sucks, but if this is a one truck company, you have effectively lost your business until you pay. fighting this to through the courts is a long battle. Also, it's something that is happening now, and has been happening for a while, so the battle is far from over.

Me, as a one truck carrier, I am likely to play defeated, and hope the truck doesn't get moved immediately as I am attempting to try to get money. With an opening, I am getting the hell out of the state, and living to fight another day. Without that option, really not sure where to go to get this resolved.

In the case of this guy, he had to pay $8800 to keep his truck from being impounded. he had a driver caught up in this as well.

Granted, I could pay that money immediately and get the truck out of there, but that type of attack into the revenue could cripple a small operation very quickly.

 

[Hammer166]

Yes, aware of that. To keep it on trucking though, how do you deal with this? Losing guns is sucks, but if this is a one truck company, you have effectively lost your business until you pay. fighting this to through the courts is a long battle. Also, it's something that is happening now, and has been happening for a while, so the battle is far from over.

Me, as a one truck carrier, I am likely to play defeated, and hope the truck doesn't get moved immediately as I am attempting to try to get money. With an opening, I am getting the hell out of the state, and living to fight another day. Without that option, really not sure where to go to get this resolved.

In the case of this guy, he had to pay $8800 to keep his truck from being impounded. he had a driver caught up in this as well.

Granted, I could pay that money immediately and get the truck out of there, but that type of attack into the revenue could cripple a small operation very quickly.

Of course you have to pay it, and the state full well knows that. It's extortion, plain and simple.

And this kind of thing is why we moved from the Articles of Confederation to the Republic set up in the Constitution. This behavior by a state is actually a much bigger deal than it appears on the surface.

 

[Mike]

This behavior by a state is actually a much bigger deal than it appears on the surface.

Exactly, and thank you for recognizing this without taking it political.

It puts the tiny trucking companies in a major mess, especially if you end up in a state like New Jersey that is willing to trap trucks in scales.

The situation that I mentioned to start this thread is real, and it just happened. Last check, it hadn't been resolved.

There are small companies like mine, particularly startups, with only one or two trucks, who simply cannot absorb an unexpected cost like this. Meaning, they CANNOT pay. Living to fight this through the courts is not an option, and they lose their equipment.

 

[BlueStingray]

This is a very real world situation that @Mike mentioned here. It will effect small outfits who dont have alot of trucks and not having alot of liquid assets to handle a stop like this.
4 yrs ago i remember being two steps ahead of what i was doing in trucking. I had no way of swallowing that nut that the NJ scale house put on that trucking company.
not a state i will be going to anytime soon i can say that. this is a real question to be pondered....

 

[Mike]

This is a very real world situation that @Mike mentioned here. It will effect small outfits who dont have alot of trucks and not having alot of liquid assets to handle a stop like this.
4 yrs ago i remember being two steps ahead of what i was doing in trucking. I had no way of swallowing that nut that the NJ scale house put on that trucking company.
not a state i will be going to anytime soon i can say that. this is a real question to be pondered....

And this is a situation that I have seen become reality multiple times in New Jersey. I'm not saying that New Jersey is the only state guilty of this, but it has come up enough in reality from my perspective to stay away from not only that state, but from that region as a whole. When stupid things are happening, it is a good idea to stay away from that stupidity and stay away at the largest distance possible.

I can't run in California because I have a dirty non emissions Detroit motor that gets a disgusting air polluting MPG of almost 8.5mpg. Because I can't go to California, I stay clear of almost every state near there due to the revenue hit I risk of being limited as I get closer to there.

I'm veering off topic a bit here, but the point is, I stay out of New Jersey for the reason mentioned here, and i stay out of states where I risk needing to enter that screwed up state for the very same reason.

 

[mndriver]

Have you got a link to the actual case.....

 

[Mike]

Have you got a link to the actual case.....

Me? No. Just a situation happening right now with a small company owner. There wouldn’t be a link for something like this.

 

[mndriver]

Just curious if this is a case like "you must have white color sheets" incident.


I'd figure this would be all over the truckstop news rags

 

[Duck]

Just curious if this is a case like "you must have white color sheets" incident.


I'd figure this would be all over the truckstop news rags

And I'd think OOIDA would be all over it too.
This is pure criminal redcoat behavior similar to civil asset forfeiture.

 

[Uncle Birchy]

Ya stay the heck away from those money grubbing bastards!

Seriously though, this is a place where the federal government is supposed to step in and tell the state to knock it off! This is no different than if a state said to Microsoft (assuming MS has no offices there) "We know you're making income from people using your product in our craphole state. You owe us income taxes!"

Awe but those "Precious" States Rights..

Actually trucking should be fully FEDERALLY Regulated and cut the States "completely" out of it using the "Commerce Clause"..

Should be one solid set of rules to know not Fifty different States screwing it up with their own stupid ideas too

 

[Mike]

Just curious if this is a case like "you must have white color sheets" incident.


I'd figure this would be all over the truckstop news rags

No, it was a guy who had a driver being held hostage at a weigh station and was asking for help on how to proceed other than simply paying the money to keep his truck from being impounded. Guy was in a jam and freaking out

 

[mndriver]

It's not the first time I have heard of this.

And I have never found any reference to it ever in a news article etc.

Nothing.


Just rumors that, "this guy had a driver" and there's no more information.

Ooida has never even mentioned it as an offer in their services..some of the other big truck service providers don't even say we can help you with new Jersey....

I get offers for assistance for New York and Kentucky annuallly.

Yet nothing from new Jersey

 

[Oxbow]

First off, don't say that that you would just leave, or anything silly like that, because that's not going to happen. If you are in this situation, you are going to have to address it properly and know where you stand legally.

So, I will start it with a situation from New Jersey. Not my situation, but one that I just read about happening.



Truck owner has a driver trapped at a scale. Pay or have truck impounded. Impounded equals massive daily fees that will reach the ransom fee very quickly, so don't think you are just gonna allow the truck to be impounded and get the driver transportation home.

Where is this happening, and what do you do to protect yourself?

@Ruthless do you have any comment on this?

 

[Ruthless]

It's not the first time I have heard of this.

And I have never found any reference to it ever in a news article etc.

Nothing.


Just rumors that, "this guy had a driver" and there's no more information.

Ooida has never even mentioned it as an offer in their services..some of the other big truck service providers don't even say we can help you with new Jersey....

I get offers for assistance for New York and Kentucky annuallly.

Yet nothing from new Jersey

It’s 100% real. Everybody doesn’t know everybody it ever happened to til it happens to them or someone they know. The inspection Station on 295 coming up out of Delaware is known for being big on that particular catch.

@Ruthless do you have any comment on this?

Well, I run as legal as it makes sense to.